Holochain Forum

Holochain concept confusion regarding internet usage

Hye, im new to holochain concept and still learning about it. I have a bit of confusion regarding the concept of holochain regarding the internet usage.

The question goes:
So, let say we have a DHT of A, B, C, and D nodes. A then uploads a picture into the DHT and the picture splits into shards and each of them stores the shards.
Now suddenly a new node, E entered the DHT. E then wants to see the picture uploaded by A. So E needs to download the picture from DHT.
At the same time, A, B, C, D must upload the shards from their device so E can be able to download it.
Hence, in term of internet usage, does A, B, C, and D used their internet quota to send their shards to E?
Forgive me if im wrong.

yes, they do, however, A, B, C, D are paid for their uptime in HoloFuel for the asset. Holochain will demand that uptime for nodes listed here is 95%!

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I worry your answer will create MORE confusion because you’re assuming that the Holochain app is being hosted on Holo, which may not be the case. Holochain and Holo are different (they just, confusingly, have exactly the same name, which IMO is and has always been a mistake that perpetuates precisely this kind of confusion). Holochain is the free, open-source framework for p2p apps, and Holo is an optional service for hosting.

@Najidnadri I actually don’t know the answer to your question. Hopefully someone else can help you better, but I can say a couple things. One, I don’t think it’s necessarily the case that the picture would be always be broken up. It might be that “sharded,” in this particular app, means that ‘B’ is responsible for the hash neighborhood in which the picture was shared, so ‘B’ holds the entire picture file, and ‘C’ also holds a redundant copy. Or maybe there are other variations possible. Not sure. Also, I’m confused by what you mean by “internet quota.”

This might help, if you haven’t already read it: DHT - Holochain Docs

I think the OP would gain by taking a look also at [just in case if they haven’t already] Holochain’s (patented) rrDHT and how it handles gossiping things around…

So if I dropped Holochain for Holo is there a difference in the accuracy of the answer? I mean clearly this person asked about the Internet usage. You are worried about my interchangeable use of Holochain/Holo, which you admit is confusing, and then you answer and say I don’t know how to answer or help you? Did I miss something here? The question was about the Internet usage.

The answer is here: Three Holo Networks - Holochain Blog

He’s asking about the bandwidth a node will have to commit.

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So in conclusion, each nodes in holochain/holo will get paid in holofuel for contributing to the DHT? Or is there any condition for a node to be paid?

Holochain uses the Internet without using a web browser. Holo is for hosting Holochain applications to be accessible via web browser and accessible to web users who don’t need to install Holochain.

Yes, your answer is inaccurate because it assumes he was asking about Holo when the Holochain DHT does not require the use of holo hosting. Also, my answer can be more accurate even though (or maybe even BECAUSE) I am able to say “I don’t know.” In other words, with more knowledge comes more uncertainty sometimes.

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No, Holochain involves no payment for contributing to the DHT.

If you think about browser or no browser and these nodes uptime of course contributing to DHT; yes. Think about not everyone can have all the data, having the neighborhoods where someone close to you can get you closer to what you need, all the ports would have to have a reasonable uptime. In the even that something like power or an event knock us all offline then we have to wait until for the network to resolve itself. I think the only solution is the size of everyone involved.

No. If you are using “pure holochain” without the Holo Hosting network, there is no payment involved. Only if you are using the Holo Hosting network is HoloFuel applicable.

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In the end, he is asking about the uptime of a machine, because let’s face it DHT or not, the machine has to have a min upload time to function.

No one here is talking about any other network and I’m referring to Holochain, not Holo.

Also, I’m pretty sure the answer here is “Yes”. If you have a data cap from your internet provider, then transmitting that data to other users will most likely count against it. I see no reason why packets sent through the network via a holochain app wouldn’t count against your quota.

If you are talking about Holochain, not Holo, then Holofuel is not used to pay for uptime. The green checkmark “solution” response is incorrect.

Holochain does not demand uptime. Holofuel is not paid for participating in a Holochain application.

yeah but we are not talking about using pure holochain.

Dude this is getting nuts, I just linked to the answer where this was just discussed like a day ago.

I’m sorry I’m extremely confused. You seem to be completely contradicting yourself.

This blog post? Three Holo Networks - Holochain Blog

“The Holo hosting dev team will assign all hosts in the HoloPort Alpha Program to one of three networks”

Those are HOLO networks, not Holochain. As I said before, Holochain is the free, open-source framework, which is not the same thing as the Holo hosting service. That blog post is about Holo hosting.

that was instance of just local, I have it on my mac locally; I don’t get paid for it.

I think you are confused about the scope of this question, he is referring to the quota, so then we are talking about “some network”, not the framework itself; correct?