I wouldn’t mind a late evening next week - say Thursday/Friday/Saturday
I created a doodle poll here https://doodle.com/poll/69x6493h3rbke4qt. Please participate, and let me know if there are no good options for you. Pospi, it’s pretty limited for you, sorry! Figuring that functional users are priority. We can record if that is OK with everyone.
@pospi @akikoogawa7 @kamal @oro13 @starglide @ViktorZaunders @mhueschen
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Thanks everyone. With apologies to Viktor and Pospi, I think we should meet this Friday noon CDT, 10am PDT, 6pm London, 7pm Brussels. This is for the mapping exercise @starglide will lead us through. This is one step in an ongoing discussion of possible synergy of his work and ValueFlows/Holo-REA - starting with understanding how his Canvas tool works with some use cases we have been discussing. From there we can assess better how the projects might benefit each other.
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Hi all,
Got wind of this through Chad Monfreda from the Earth Regenerator network and learned about mycelia and their work with Terran Collective. It feels like lots of similar conversations around Hylo, Holochain, food, and mushrooms!!! Just wanted to share and loving how the world is getting smaller and smaller! https://mycelia.earth - The two videos are really helpful to get context around Hylo & Holo and I want to continue helping bridge those two worlds.
Kamal
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Thanks for sharing the Mycelia link! I’m in the Bay Area and attended (for my first time) Terran’s “Regen Collab” call yesterday, and actually asked about the Hylo & Holo/chain. I watched part of the first video last night after the call and it seems to give a more in-depth overview of that relationship. Exciting synergy 
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Thank you all for participating to the mapping session. (it was useful to me, I hope it was the same for you too!!)
I am going to clean up what we did and I will keep in mind the REA diagram we have here to see what we added to it.
Lynn, answering to your question “what’s next”…
On one side, I think it could be useful for me to see how the software behind http://locecon.org/ works, especially
- on the mapping side, if it allows to do a real time exercise similar to what we did while recording the links and populating the database,
- also on the mapping side, if it allows to set several types of links between agents, so that we can map the 5 types present in the canvas (money, labour, knowledge, resources and social bonds or intangibles). It would also help to have/set link weights and link colours.
- on the reporting side, to understand what it reports on, and if it allows to read several networks and do reporting horizontally
In addition I will also give a better look at the document “How to model value flows in networks”. I think the challenge here is to set a level of granularity that is coarse enough to highlight the key transactions that count in a particular case with a special emphasis on social bonds (useful for policymaking), while allowing to drill deeper in case there is interest (more useful to practitioners, to maybe exchange specific practices and learnings).
For the moment, just thanks!!
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I think so, but it would be more awkward and slower. It used to create a resource flow diagram in a panel on the side as you entered data, but it’s very old software, and that part broke and I never fixed it. We hope to be able to recreate the ideas in Holochain. Maybe we can mix in both locecon and economic canvas ideas?
Can do.
As of now, the reports include:
- economic gaps (resources created but not used in the network, and used but not created in the network)
- function-resource table (sorta Leontief-style input-output table)
- value-added by each stage of resource processing in a flow through several agents or functions.
Cannot combine data from more than one network. But that capability could be added in a new Holochain version.
The data model behind locecon is pretty much the same as ValueFlows Scenarios:
https://valueflo.ws/introduction/estimates.html
Good challenge! That was the same goal as the group in Nova Scotia fisheries that we first worked with http://locecon.org/nova-story/ and also the Mutual Aid Network in Madison WI https://www.mutualaidnetwork.org/ . Both of them want to be able to spiral back and forth from the aggregate level of Locecon/Scenarios and the operational details. We’ve never made it happen yet, though. Requires both live networks and software developers collaborating deeply and also supported economically.
But @starglide if you really don’t have enough to do, I will give you login credentials and you can try locecon…or at least look at the help pages, which are not public.
By “not public”, I mean you need to be logged in to see them.
But that was a mistake, should have been public. I can copy the contents for you if you want to read them without logging in.
That sounds great! 
Ok,
the page with the diagram is available at
https://webgate.ec.europa.eu/fpfis/wikis/display/SEC/holoFood
To get access please follow the procedure here
https://blogs.ec.europa.eu/eupolicylab/portfolios/social-economy-canvas/
I have added some new elements to the diagram we discussed, maybe we can go through this new version together…
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Yes, will post it shortly.
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Hi all, thanks again, looking great @starglide. I’d be happy to jump on again to go through this.
Here’s the video of our conversation.
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@starglide thanks for cleaning up and organizing the diagram, looks great and you’ve added some interesting thoughts. I’d be happy to go through it together if others want to do that. I’m also aware that August is not everyone’s “work a lot” time. 
Some musings on this exercise and on ‘economic network formation’ in relation to something like ‘economic network operations’. I think that might be in the same realm as Alessandro’s thoughts about ‘static’ vs ‘dynamic’? And also what @bhaugen was mentioning about groups who:
…want to be able to spiral back and forth from the aggregate level of Locecon/Scenarios and the operational details. We’ve never made it happen yet, though.
ValueFlows will support both, and eventually Holo-REA will support both, I hope. They have the same basic pattern or shape, but are not the same.
I think that what we are doing in Alessandro’s HoloFood exercise is the initial network thinking that is helpful in forming networks, or adding to or re-configuring existing networks, or thinking about existing networks in order to implement software, like a lot of @kamal’s diagrams . It is analytical. If numbers are applied to these resource flows, they tend to be “per year” or similar (or in the Canvas I saw something like small-medium-large relatively), and the “resource” on a resource flow tends to be a more general classification than what you need for operational flows. Operational flows, which is what most of us have been moving towards for HoloFood and in HoloREA code, are either specifically planned or actually completed flows with real numbers, dates, and resources that are either moved in/out of inventories or are defined as specifically as needed for involved agents to understand exactly what they are, if not inventoried.
It would be fun to interconnect these 2 levels in the spiral Bob talked about… all in good time I guess…
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This map is super helpful. I’m trying to a get a few questions understood, I hope to come back to this, but it’s really helped me frame my thinking. Hope to touch back on this very soon!
Hi everyone,
Sorry for the delay. @starglide @lynnfoster @bhaugen @akikoogawa7 @mhueschen @pospi @ViktorZaunders @oro13
Kiki and I just met up and reviewed Alessandro’s map. We’d love to get a tour of what Alessandro built if you’re available and interested @starglide?
If there’s time on the same call or a different call we’d love to share a few ideas we’re kicking around to see if we can find some integration points or models to think through and embrace this map. Maybe Friday 9am PST next week?
Alessandro, if you’d like us all to meet separately and report back to you, that works too. You’ve done plenty here and we’re very appreciative of this map and work!
Thanks,
Kamal